What will Alibre sheetmetal do?

[HaroldL]

What will Alibre sheetmetal do?

I thought I'd wait for the furor to die down a bit on V9 before I chimmed in with my $.02.
I haven't upgraded yet but did order the CD, since that's how I installed v8.2. and want to do the upgrade the same way. From what I've seen and read here in the various posts the upgrade is typical of any program with any complexity. It's always a finger-crossing experience.

I guess my concern and anticipation is will Alibre do what I want it to in regard to the sheetmetal module. I've been a bit anxious to see what the programmers did since the announcement that Alibre was partnering with Amada. And from the previews I've seen with the new punch features there may be a good start. But along with Single-D and Double-D punches and the various arays that can be created, there has to be some formed features, i.e., louvers, knock outs (both single and concentric), card guides, bridge lances. jog forms, etc. These are features that will help make Alibre a powerful tool.

I am heartened that Alibre will create enclosures with "airtight edges". Does this mean that the flanges can be created so they are actually in contact with the adjacent sides/flanges? Even S-works can't do that, there has to be a small gap between the flanges otherwise the flanges will become one feature.

The example given on the Alibre site is really interesting. I would like to see the press brake that will form this enclosure in the real world (http://www.alibre.com/products/new-in-ad90.asp). :? You could maybe do it with a cardboard cutout and form it by hand but show me the machine.

I guess it just goes to show you that with cad you can create anything you can think of. The issue becomes, can you make it. Another question is, Do the programmers really know anything about sheetmetal fabrication or do they just write code? Or is it just an over-achieving cad operator cranking out another model without regard to capability?

I've had conversations with tech support on other cad programs where it became painfully obvious that they had no idea of the actual fabrication process but were real wizzes at decribing how to find all the wiz-bang features in their program. I wonder if that is the case at Alibre.

I don't want this to become a rant so I'll close this for now.
HaroldL

 

[Bryan OT]

I agree with you Harold that the box image is not really manufacturable. How will you get the tooling out? On the airtight seals there is one CAD program that does do that and has been doing it for a couple years now. That is Solid Edge. I have gotten interested in Alibre when I read about the partnership with Amada. Currently the best system for sheet metal is Solid Edge. However Alibre might be on the right track to challenge.

Bryan Lagrange

 

[dmckee101]

I've been using simple features of Alibre sheet-metal, flanges, holes, that sort of thing. So I'll limit my input here to what I know.

With regard to the software allowing you to design something that can't be made; that's always been the case. Since I started doing design with pencil, paper, and a drafting machine (and you know I don't mean computer ) there have been those people who have developed a nice design, only to find out later that it can't be built. I'll admit I had my share of that.

The designs of our imagination should not be limited by our tools, i.e. CAD. If that were so, how could we move forward? The limtation of current manufacturing technology is something that a good designer should be aware of, or at least examine.

Cheers,
Dennis

 

[mtauer]

there have been those people who have developed a nice design, only to find out later that it can't be built.

Hey, I have worked with a few industrial designers like this :lol:
That is where a good product/mechanical designer comes in.
CAD is a tool to assist in getting the job done. It is not a substitute knowledge.
g.i.g.o garbage in garbage out.

The limtation of current manufacturing technology is something that a good designer should be aware of, or at least examine.

and push the manufacturing envelope, innovate

Mark

 

[ksudavid]

What I'm waiting for is for Alibre's sheet metal module to create and flatten rolled and lofted parts. I also need to be able to create normal cutouts on rolled parts using intersection curves. I originally looked at Alibre 1 1/2 years ago. My sales contact make big promises regarding the sheet metal module. Fortunately I didn't listen or I might be out of a job. Can anyone who uses the software regularly tell me if V9 and made any progress in these areas.

We purchased Solid Edge but the high price limited us to 2 seats. I keep watching Alibre's enhancements but some of the promises made to me still aren't appearing.

 

[Jimpulse]

I have just gotten around to dnlding the 9.0 release, and must say that I have not given it a thorough check out. The first thing I did was go to the Shtmtl module to see what was new....
I would love to be proven wrong, but there appears to be NO improvements to the sheetmetal core funtionality other than the addition of the "configurations" facility there and a "hole shape wizard"

Please, please.... someone tell me that there is more to this release than that.

 

[bhershberger]

ksudavid,

There are no significant sheet metal enhancements in v9, at least as far as I'm concerned. I'd wait for the next release (hopefully) if you need serious sheetmetal functionality.

-Bernard

 

[HaroldL]

Well, I've finally installed v9 and had a chance to run thru some of the new sheet metal tools. And with the exception of the ability to form closed boxes, i.e.; surface-to-surface forms on adjacent sides, (even SolidWorks can't do that) I can't say I'm thrilled with the enhancements to sheet metal. The new "Shape" tool offers a couple of patterns that you can't get already with circular and rectangular patterns. The shapes themselves seem to be nothing more than enhanced sketches, still it should help by not having to dimension and constrain the D, Double-D, and Radiused Rectangle if done the "old" way.

I've noticed that the one thing that is missing in the online help for the shape tools is the mention that when you are finished applying the shape and dismiss the dialog, you have to use the Cut tool to complete the feature. Unless I missed it somewhere else. I would think that a "Cut" button in the shape dialog would be a nice enhancement.

Beyond that, where are the louvers, bridge lances, knock outs, card guides, etc? I'm sure that with the partnership with Amada these form features must have come up in the conversation. I was hoping that these would be part of this release.

I haven't tried the configurations yet, but from what I've read here in the forums, it seems like Alibre put most of the programming effort into them.

Hey Alibre, would it be possible for you to let us know what you are doing for the next release? Are you adding some of these special tools to sheetmetal? Of course, you don't want to give away you're competitive edge or tip off the competition, but a hint of things to come would be nice.

I still think that, dollar for dollar, Alibre is a great value when compared to the big guns.

HaroldL

 

[cdub]

sheetmetal woes

I too had heard big promises about updates to sheetmetal.

I too am disappointed with the V9 sheetmetal package.

I'm looking for cylindrical and conical shapes, lofts, etc. Also want to form a "flange" based on a curved edge (something I've discussed with some of you at length in another post).

None of this appeared in V9.

I do like the D-holes and patterning tools though.

 

[indesign]

My bet is this will be things added as the improvements are made. Please make specific requests in the enhancemnet forum for each feature you want.

 

[jemmej]

I agree they could and will be implemented. But Alibre tends to oversell itself to its existing customers. I've talked on numerous occasions with Alibre sales reps and Alibre Assistants over the past year and a half that explained that first with v8.2 and then in v9 that the sheetmetal package would not only be improved, but would become better than Solid Edge (considered the best of the mid-range as far as sheetmetal). It is currently far from that lofty goal.

I am not complaining about the product itself (other than the usual request for enhancments) but the continued hype and then failue to live up to it. If you said, "hey we're going to add waterproof corners and a fairly configurable punch pattern tool", we'd all be "satisfied" that Alibre delivered on its promise while eagerly looking forward to the next release of enhancments. However, I wasn't promised a few enhancements, I was promised jaw-dropping, world class enhancements. These have yet to arrive. Perhaps they will be coming soon. But Alibre needs to do a better job (in my opinion) of managing expectations. Its one thing to proclaim yourselves comparable to other MCAD packages (I'll even allow "equal" as far as marketing-speak). But if you throw out the word "better", well, then you should demonstrably be "better".

My dollar's worth! [end soap box]

Jim

P.S. I think Alibre is a terrific product and stand behind them and there continued success 100%. My criticisms are only meant to help improve a wonderful software product and concept.

 

[swertel]

Re:

P.S. I think Alibre is a terrific product and stand behind them and there continued success 100%. My criticisms are only meant to help improve a wonderful software product and concept.

Why do so many people state this after they criticize the software? Worried about flames? Constructive criticism is what this forum is all about. That's how things improve.

 

[jemmej]

Worried about flames? No. Worried about other's opinion of me? No. The knee-jerk reaction to a criticism of Alibre is to say "if you don't like the software...." or "if you want that go pay $$$$....". I just wanted to reiterate the balance of my opinion. Its quite hard to determine a person's frame of mind from a forum post.

Did you know that we understand the "tone" of only 50% of what we read in e-mails, yet think we understand the "tone" correctly 90% of the time? Explains why smart, intelligent, calm, open-minded and even-keeled people (such as myself ) can still get drawn into flamefests on-line.

The "disclaimer" is because I posted a similar comment on another topic and had to wade through many posts similar to the kind quoted above.

Thanks Scott!

P-X