Cabinet Design

[mattyfatbags]

Cabinet Design

Though I work at a cabinet shop, I bought Alibre for a different line of work where 3D and parametrics really matter. I know Alibre doesn't really stack up against programs designed specifically for building standard cabinets, but I thought it'd be worth seeing how far I could get.

Right now I'm hung up on the issue that I can't link an Excel file to a "project". Let's say I create a "standard" cabinet with a toe kick, a case, doors, scribe, and a counter top. I then create an Excel file to manage all the parameters and relationships. Now all I have to do is go to my Excel file, update the global driving parameters, and I've got the cabinet I want.

But how do I go about making a new instance of this cabinet? I can save the cabinet assembly to a new folder, but my Excel file won't go with it. Also, all the links in the parts in the new folder point to the Excel file in the original folder. So I would have to also copy the Excel file with all my parameters and re-establish them to the parts in the new folder.

Am I missing something?

 

[DavidJ]

Not a complete answer, but a workround might be to define a fixed folder and file name for your 'currently active' Excel file. You would have to copy the appropriate spreadsheet to this location when working on a particular assembly. The basic idea is that you use what appears (to AD) to be the same Excel file for every assembly

NB This is just how I'd try a workround - I'm supposing that AD just uses the file name/location of the Excel file and NOT any unique Windows fileID number (that would ruin this particular approach).

I hope there is a more elegant way - but this might get you going.

EDIT - the obvious downside is that you have to remember to save the active Excel file back with the assembly after completing any work. This would be a pain if you work concurrenlty with many assemblies.

Maybe try this with something trivial first, in case there are hidden problems.

 

[mattyfatbags]

Not a very elegant solution - but I like your thinking. Seems like there are many "should-be" features in Alibre that require this sort of approach.

I think this approach will work well for small scale projects of a single cabinet or two. But I don't think it would scale well to larger projects with many assemblies. I'll bring this up with tech support. It doesn't seem like it should be much of a software engineering effort to link an excel file to an assembly so that the excel file can "travel" with the assembly when you do a Save As.

Thanks

 

[WoodWorks]

The LINK button in the Equation Editor can be used to link you model created with the SaveAs, to a spreadsheet in a new location (such as a copy saved in the same folder as your new cabinet).

If I remember correctly, Alibre 10 allows you to use the Link button even when the link is still valid. However, if you simply move the original spreadsheet to a new location, then you should be prompted for a new link location for your spreadsheet when you open the file (as it can not locate the original spreadsheet). A little cumbersome, but not too bad.

However I prefer to use Configurations and create multiple parts within a single part file, that can then be linked via the parameters contained in the Part file. Create new parameter entries for each new parts dimension. We create 5 parameters for each part (X, Y, & Z dimension, and Offset X & Y dimension to locate the part about the origin (with Z dimension being thickness)).

I think the Alibre community has not yet come to realize that a revolutionary advance has been made in the use of Alibre with Alex Franke's Parameter Wizard: http://www.codecreations.com/site/alibr ... bre-design
You can now link parameters between multiple part files, Assemblies, Assemblies and Part files, and even Drawings (yes there is an Equation Editor in Drawings but no Ctrl+E shortcut or f(x) icon). Rather than having to use the approach of using configurations to create multiple parts in a single part file (artificial global parameters), a more traditional approach of using individual part files can be used to create the cabinet parts, and the Parameter Wizard used to synchronize those parameters. To drive these common parameters in the part files, I have even Added "specifying parameters" in the top level Assembly file, that allows the user to change the value of those parameters, save and close the assembly file, and then use the Parameter Wizard to update all the associated part files. I use a common name at the beginning of all the files to define an association (such as "NorthBase1") in front of each part and assembly file. When the top level assembly file is opened again, all the parts have been resized and the Cabinet is now of the new size. There are quite a few formulas involved for each part, but that is what "parametric" CAD is all about - using parameters to define relationships that will save us time when the design model changes. Something the new generation of "History Free" modelers has yet to include in their capabilities. It may be nice to drag parts to new sizes, but I like that all my parts to change with a single change of a parameter value, and not have to drag each part to their new dimensions. SketchUp et.al. is a nice piece of software, however Alibre Design is better suited to the woodworking and cabinet design application. But I digress....

Alex Franke's Parameter Wizard provides revolutionary capabilities to Alibre in allowing use to not only coordinate dimensions between our Alibre files, but to use comma separated files (.csv) and even Excel spreadsheets to drive parameters. The additional spreadsheet interface is revolutionary in itself, as there is no more need to inextricably link the spreadsheet to the Alibre file (and once linked in Alibre, you better have a backup before the link if you want to use the model again without being spreadsheet driven). I have not used the Parameter Wizard much with Spreadsheets as I prefer to work directly with parameters defined in the top level assembly, or .csv files. But I will be glad to work with anyone needing help in getting models to work with the Parameter Wizard (even non-woodworking models).

I also believe that the Parameter Wizard is a superior approach to synchronizing parameters among various Alibre files. While SolidWorks has the ability to link parameters internally, the posts in their forums discourage this type of use due to loss of linking and other headaches in the maintenance and stability of a design. And their access to parameters via the individual entry boxes would make it a nightmare to define and maintain the type of complex parametric relationships that I currently have defined and maintain in Alibre's tabular Equation Editor. I have looked into creating the same woodworking templates in SW as I now have defined in Alibre, as there is a move among woodworkers toward the use of parametric software for greater design flexibility than the current woodworking software. The point of this paragraph is the superiority of Alex's approach with the Parameter Wizard and externally driven linking of Alibre files. Rather than encouraging Alibre to add an enhancement to link parameters, I am definitely against it. Once you save your defined parameter links in the Parameter Wizard, you can run them again and again. Add an EASY button via AutoHotKey scripting, and you can create a job that will update your entire Kitchen project with parameter changes. I moved from traditional cabinet software to Alibre when I got fed up with having to change the width of face frames 5 times during the course of a design when the customer vacillated on their width. I could have really used the Parameter Wizard to change my face reveals on a cabinet job from 3/32" to 1/8", as it would have been over in even less time. Alex has discussed adding command line arguments to his Parameter Wizard, and once that has been done, I expect to create even more definitions to update entire folders of cabinets, as well as synchronized their common parameter values.

Maybe I strayed bit off the original topic, but yes there are ways to use a spreadsheet to drive Alibre designs. Other than the ability to do "if" type decisions, the functions in the Alibre Equation Editor have proven adequate for the task of defining cabinet parts. I have even included construction "flags" to define if such things as the type of base (Euro Detached vs. Integral). A scale value of 0 or 1, with multiplication of base dimensions parameters works quite well, and I no longer have to change formulas for differences in construction. Anyone wanting to discuss the details of design in this manner are welcome to start a new thread where we can share this information with everyone.

I want to end with re-iterating that Alex Franke's Parameter Wizard is a revolutionary improvement in manipulating parameters within Alibre models, and that it should be an essential tool owned by everyone interested in getting the most from their use of Alibre.

 

[NateLiquidGravity]

I don't want to derail the topic here but I agree 100% with WoodWorks on this issue.

You see I was the victim of configurations gone bad. :twisted: I left some stuff locked while editing, adding, and removing some features and sketches not knowing its consequence. :x All I had wanted was configurations for unsuppressed and suppressed features. :roll: I was left with screwed up features everywhere. :cry: Then I discovered the amazing wonder that is Alex Franke's Parameter Wizard. I was able to extract the parameters from the one good configuration into a .csv file. Then load that file into Alex Franke's Parameter Wizard as a source and my part as the destination. The Wizard waved his wand and fixed all of my configurations. The kingdom was safe again!

All true. I hope the smilies helped convey the feelings right.

 

[WoodWorks]

Configurations and locks can be the topic of an entire range of new forum topics. However, my recommendation is to construct all new features with every configuration unlocked. This way all the parameters associated with the new feature will display the correct values in every configuration. After you complete the new feature, lock the configurations where you wish to have the new feature, switch to a configuration where you wish to have the feature suppressed, and suppress the feature. Then unlock all configurations again. This has proven to be the most foolproof method of dealing with features where there are multiple configurations.

I work with all configurations unlocked, and only LOCKALL when I need a parameter to have a different value between configurations, or doing the suppression. It has proven to not be worth the complication to deal with individual locks, as there is a large potential for problems.

We also use the convention of full lower case names where a parameter has different values per configuration. It is a warning flag not to modify that parameter without having locked configurations. Our normal parameter naming uses mixed case with the first letter of each word being capitalized. We also use the convention of ALL CAPS for parameter names that we refer to as "specifying parameters" that are used to provide information used by formulas to determine part sizes. For a cabinet model, such would be CABINET_WIDTH, CABINET_DEPTH, CABINET_COUNTERHEIGHT..... Our template users know that it is safe to modify any all caps parameter, and in fact that it is these parameter that they only need be concerned with in order to provide all the information necessary to configure a cabinet or drawer box. However, in the Equation section for parameters, we use only the mixed case naming and do not duplicate the full upper or lower case parameter names. It is too much work to keep changing each Equation as a parameter changes in capitalization due to a change in use. We often end up changing the full caps specifying parameters as we keep increasing the sophistication of our templates. While one day the CABINET_DEPTH may be a specifying parameter, the next version may have CABINET_DEPTHFACE as the specifying parameter because customers usually give us the cabinet depth to the front of the face and not the case (and because the wife insists that is what she wants to enter in the template). Visit the thread concerning our Part Template and observe how we constructed the single rectangular part. The actual parameter that are used in the sketch are lower case. We then provide a set of 5 parameters for each part in a a model such as a case that provide values for those dimensions. We then lock the configuration for that "part" such as Top, and change the part_x parameter to have the Top_X parameter name in the equation field. That allows users to freely modify the formulas for the Top part, without having to lock configurations. The only time they need to lock a configuration is when adding a new configuration and defining the Equation field for the lower case "part_ " parameters.

I derailed this topic, but the point being that there are many other options beside spreadsheets to accomplish what you want to do, and you can even use spreadsheets as well.

 

[WET]

Here is a method that I use to lock and unlock multiple configurations:

1. Select multiple configurations by using Shift+Left Click or Left Click on Configurations to select all configurations (configurations will be highlighted)
2. Point the mouse over the highlighted selection and press CTRL+Shift+Right Click
3. Select Lock or Unlock from the pop up menu