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Make accurate bends with box-and-pan brake on 1st try?

Rare Waves

New Member
If you have experience forming sheet metal parts accurately on a box-and-pan brake from Alibre flat patterns, I would like to hear your methodology.

Our parts are small (typically < 12”) and made of 5000-series aluminum alloy sheet of 0.040”-0.063” thickness. My goal is to succeed in forming 90-degree bends to reasonably tight tolerance (+/- 1/64”) on the first try. The purpose is prototyping, one-off jobs. I’d like to avoid having to make one, measure the error, trash it, sketch up the flat pattern, and then try again.

Now the specifics, please refer to "Bend formation reference.jpg". The pan and box brake, you are familiar with, it has a clamp edge and an apron edge. In practice the operator sets the distance between these lines to about 1.5MT, or ~0.10” if the workpiece is 1/16” thick.

We enter published K-factors and reasonable bend radii as the parameters. Then Alibre generates flat patterns from sheet metal parts, and for each bend the flat pattern has two lines plus a optionally displayed bend centerline.

We copy the lines from the flat pattern onto the sheet metal part accurately. Now, the brake operator clamps the part it in the brake, pulls up the apron, and forms the bend. Obviously the part must be positioned accurately in the machine or you obtain a flange of the wrong length.

But, that’s where it gets confusing. What I want to know is, when the brake operator has clamped the sheet in the brake and is about to form the bend, exactly how do the bend lines on the Alibre flat pattern relate to the position of the lines represented by the machine’s clamp edge and apron edge? Can you succeed in forming an accurate bend, for example, by fixturing the part with line A co-linear with the clamp edge? Or do you find it necessary to manually sketch in a 4th line, offset by some experience-based fudge factor, for the brake operator to visually line up co-linear with the clamp edge?
 

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  • Bend formation reference.jpg
    Bend formation reference.jpg
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JST

Alibre Super User
You need to use the "bend allowance" method of figuring the bend lines, and not the silly "K-factor", which is just a non-useful pain in the posterior. A banned member who explained the difference also held that view. He was correct, and posted a conversion process between the two.

For 90 degree bends......

Once you locate the actual bend line, using the bend allowance, then you need to put that line ahead of the "point" of the box and pan "punch" (the forming die), by the amount that will place it halfway around the rounded nose of the "punch".

That has worked for me first time/every time, when making prototypes. There is a slight theoretical error, but in practice with 90 degree bends, it works. At other angles, it is different.

There is a tendency to put the bend line too close to the nose of the "punch", which leads to wrong dimensions.
 

Rare Waves

New Member
Thats interesting. I haven’t tried the Bend Allowance options in sheet metal flange dialog yet. It asks for Unfold Length. How do you arrive at an appropriate value of that parameter?

The fingers on our brake are almost a knife edge. The radius of the punch is only about 0.005”.
 

HaroldL

Alibre Super User
You'll need a spread sheet for this to record the data. This method is for calculating the Bend Deduction by using test blanks.
Here is a link to a PDF describing a process for finding the BD
 

JST

Alibre Super User
I have posted this before. I used this, including the full formula, for years when designing sheet metal chassis. They always worked out.

71gyTH4.jpg
 

HaroldL

Alibre Super User
I have posted this before.
That's a real flash from the past. When I started working on the press brake the only way to adjust the machine for a each bend was to turn a crank on each end of the back gauge to adjust the for the flange length. This meant measuring from the point of the punch to the stop bar on each end of the back gauge. Time consuming and wasteful for the number of "test blanks" that were formed while getting the back gauge dialed in.

Then the company purchased their first Hurco back gauge for the press brake I was running. What a world of difference - calibrate the back gauge to the punch, enter in the form lengths needed for the part and the BA for the material and the the part was formed spot-on. Parts that used to take multiple setups to form each bend individually now the back gauge could be programmed with all the forms for the part and it could be done in one set up. Once the time savings was recognized more Hurco back gauges were installed on the rest of the press brakes.
 
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